Wednesday, April 14, 2010

Christian Whoppers

This morning I punched up various news sites to catch up on the events swirling around outside my insulated little world. Same old stuff I guess. The globe is warming. The globe is not warming. Health care reform sucks. Health care reform is a start. The Pope knew. The Pope did not know.

No matter what I read, there was a counterpoint somewhere that sought to negate the take I just read. And every one of these sites contends that what it is delivering is "news" and not opinion.

One of my favorite reads in recent days has been an occasional dip into the swirling waters of "Web Today", an interesting take on world events from a supposedly Christian perspective. They state that what they are spreading is news. And of course by claiming Christian allegiance, it must be so. Christians would never lie.

Or would they?

It appears that lying is okay if you follow Luther's notion. It has it's uses when done for the sake of God and religion. But if you lean towards Calvin and his admittedly black and white interpretations of the Gospel, then lying is never okay. Seems we are left to our own devices when it comes to deciding where lying falls in our ethical cookbook.

Unless of course if we are Catholic. Being a heathen, I am only a tad higher on the Catholic food chain than a good goat. But it is my understanding that the moral compass used for Catholics worldwide is found in the pocket of whatever Pope happens to be ensconced at the Vatican. And what is of particular interest to me is they have the dual code of ethics down pat. The one our politicians use pales in comparison. But then the Catholic Church has had at least a millennium and a half to get it's duplicity down pat.

I look at the various organized religions and am awestruck that people insist on following the clowns in charge. Not that my respect means anything, what with it being the respect of a heathen. But I would have had much more respect for the Pope had he owned up to the recent flareup of abuse allegations associated with his time as a regular Joe before he attained Vatican pointed hat status. Transparency I think would have served the Church better than their centuries old tendency to lie and cover up as they always have done. Even if he had no part in the cover up, it is a moot point now.

Many Christians whine about being subjected to ridicule and teasing. Well, when you follow clowns, maybe you deserve it.

Gotta go.....................


sunshine said...

Yep. This is why I don't follow any organized religion.
I just know too much about what is really going on.
As I've said many times, and I have proof, it's not just the Catholic's that are banging little boys and girls and covering it up. It's everywhere.
Every church covers up and shuts people up everywhere! Every religion, everywhere in the world.

Put people in charge of something.. give them power and they will always take advantage of those following or looking up to them.


El Cerdo Ignatius said...

But it is my understanding that the moral compass used for Catholics worldwide is found in the pocket of whatever Pope happens to be ensconced at the Vatican.

Then I submit to you that you understand wrongly. The moral compass "used for Catholics worldwide" derives from the Bible and the Catechism of the Catholic Church. The Pope cannot go about changing it as he sees fit; and everyone in the Church, including the Pope, is bound by the Bible and CCC. If anyone fails to follow them, it is his/her personal failing, and I believe he/she will be held to account for it. (Please don't read that to mean "that person shall burn in the fires of hell forever, hahahahahaha...." That's not what I mean by being held to account, but this part of the discussion would be too lengthy for this space, so I'll leave it at that.)

Catholics follow a faith - not the "clown in charge", as you put it. And we recognize the failings of our leaders in the Church as much as you - outside the Church - do. Every Catholic I know agrees that there are structural changes to canon law that need to be made so that the default position becomes transparency.

To paint the picture of followers of the Catholic faith as a bunch of unquestioning, uncritical clown-followers, perhaps deserving of ridicule and teasing is inaccurate, unfair, hypocritical and well beneath what your generally fair standards of discourse. The icing on the cake: you actually concede that Pope Benedict may have had no role in the cover-up, but he, apparently, is a clown all the same.

I shall stop now, especially considering my obligations under CCC 2478. And to quote your own words from July 2008: "Remember, the Church encourages forgiveness, especially towards swamp rat heathens such as myself. Honestly, we really cannot help ourselves. Says so right in the Bible somewhere. I read part of a review once and they covered that." I assure you that I shall continue to pray for your swift conversion.

El Cerdo Ignatius said...

Grammar Police notation: Please strike the word "what" out of the first sentence in the second-to-last paragraph in my previous comment.

Anonymous said...

As an altar boy for six years or so I was never hit on. My sister says it's because I was too mean 'n ugly even for pedophiles.

Maybe I should have joined the Boy Scouts ....

Middle Ditch said...

Hear, hear, as we say in England. Agree with everything you say.

PipeTobacco said...


A very special thank you to El Cerdo Ignatius for his discussion of the RCC faith. His opinions concur with my own and I appreciate greatly his efforts to explain.

As a Catholic myself, I find it frustrating when people, even well intentioned people like MrMaCrum, try to blanket people of the Catholic faith in the way this essay did.

Catholicism, like any faith or philosophy can be construed in ways that can be negative. Does that mean that Catholicism is bad? No. It means simply that there can be people who who call themselves Catholic who either a) attempt to live the Catholic faith and FAIL, or b) pretend to live the Catholic faith to deceive.

Does a person who tries and fails or a person who is deceptive NEGATE what the philosophy and faith of Catholicism are all about? No.

MrMaCrum, is the US the evil horrid, hate-mongering oppressor that Bin Laden suggests, just because we had G W Bush as President? No. The US is a nation of people who are governed by a President... some are better than others, none are perfect. The same is true of the RCC.

The pedophilia is a nasty, horrid, wretched thing, but if you look into the statistics, the rate of pedophilia amongst RCC priests is not higher than it is in the whole of the male population in the US.

So, yes, the actions that are constantly being talked about are horrible, but those are actions about failures of human beings. It has nothing to do with the philosophy of Catholicism.

So, please MrMaCrum, do not try to suggest all of Catholicism is horrid, just because there are some individuals who are horrid associated with it. There are horrid people associated with everything in life.


BBC said...

Oh, the planet is going to hell, you can bet your ass on that, because almost everyone one wants so much. I recently looked at a ladies blog where her kids had so many plastic toys that I was flabbergasted.

She definitely has more more money than sense and doesn't really care about the planet and her kids future.

Prefers to paint a rosy picture for them instead, good luck with that.

PENolan said...

I have to weigh in here from the Existential Christian side of the pew and say that it's a damn shame the business of organized religion has been conducted in such a way that many folks find the very idea of stepping foot inside a church dangerous and alarming.
Although I myself don't really have a need for Sunday services and such - being a solitary practitioner on an essentially pagan path embracing Christian ethics - I can see how The Church provides a handy infrastructure for social change. Social change is what Jesus and the Buddha were both advocating, after all.
Sadly, too many of the authorities fell back into the old oppressive patterns where rich, powerful folks fuck over poor, voiceless ones.

It's a puzzlement, and it's a good thing you're providing a forum for discussion, MrMaCRUM

MRMacrum said...

sunshine - Power always seems to corrupt doesn't it? Even when wrapped in the trappings of faith and a cross. Human's do what they do.

El Cerdo Ignatius - My post followed a rather heated discussion with a local Catholic who considered the Pope infallible. When an organization's membership does not do much to call their leadership out when that leadership is wrong, then I hold the members accountable for what their leaders do. In example, as an American citizen, I own part of the blame for the stupidity my government has been involved in. And rather than hide behind rationalizations that some law makes it okay, I do stand up and call them out. I have heard precious little from the flocks of the various Christian sects in holding their leaders accountable for the travesties carried out under the protective cloak of the faith. Faith gets in the way of accountability. Relgious and political.

Would not Canon Law be the "moral compass" the Pope has in his pocket? From what I know about Canon Law and what you allude to, it is anything but transparent.

But that was not my point anyway. I apologize for not making myself clear. The Pope should have made a public statement regarding the allegations that are surfacing worldwide now. His involvement prior to him becoming Pope is moot. But his involvement as Pope in the continued cover up is not. Nothing is hurting the Catholic Church more than their refusal to own up to the mistakes they have made for many years.

A rational person knows that the abuse that has happened involves a very small percentage of the 400,000 Catholic priests out there. I know the overwhelming majority are good people. But the perception is that the Catholic Church is chock full of pedophiles. Perception trumps reality every time when the governing body continues to use secretive tactics to avoid the issue.

And please remember that I subscribe to the Georgie Tirebiter philosophy of Life - "I think we are all Bozos on this Bus." And no matter what, we are either the clown following or the clown leading. And at some point, us clowns following ought to stick our heads up to see where the clown in charge is heading.

Prester John - Yeah, I was an Acolyte in the Anglican Church for a couple of years. But he was a womanizer, not a pedophile. I was a Boy Scout also. As it turned out, not a very reliable one.

Middle Ditch - As we used to say in the States, "Right on Sister".

Pipe Tobacco - As I stated above, I hold the members of the Church responsible for the actions of their leadership. This is my opinion no matter what church, political entity, or community. Only the indigenous population can create any change of real consequence within their own structures. And until the Catholic flock begins to put more pressure on the Vatican to step up into the 21st century, the image of the Catholic Church will continue to decline.

I have no problem with people's faith, how they worship, who they pray to. But I do have a problem when they place too much faith in their leadership.

It is understandable that you may have construed my criticism of the Pope and his crew as a condemnation of your faith. We all tend to rally around the flag so to speak when a percieved threat swings by. But I think if you re-read my post, no where do I find fault with your faith. Just your church leaders.

BBC - It does seem that we humans will consume ourselves right out of existence sometimes. But I hold out the hope that eventually we will figure it out.

PENolan - The problem as I see it is the old school religions might have been at one time organizations of change, many if not most, are now organizations who fight for the status quo, or worse fight to take us back into the darkness instead of leading us out. The leadership of Islam and Christianity seem intent on doing this. So with regards to the perception that stepping into a church or mosque is indeed dangerous and alarming, then I would have to agree.

PENolan said...

I will never forget the first time I heard Firesign Theater saying, "We're all Bozos on this bus." I was in grade school and my mother was listening to the album on the family HiFi.

I doubt Mainline Religion was ever much more than a way to scare peasants into forking over money to the Priests, Shamans, Mullahs, Rabbis and whatever. There are isolated, brief shining moments - and lots of wonderful individuals - but as a group? Sheesh.

No wonder I smoke weed.

Beach Bum said...

PENolan said: No wonder I smoke weed.

And given my current state of mind I could use some myself.

And to back up Laura, the last god Christian church I attended here in Rightwingburg had the preacher systematically banging married women members of the church while pocketing a lot of money meant for local charities.

What did the good church deacons do once a irate husband dropped the bomb on them?

They quickly railroaded a severance package for the preacher through the church paid by church members trying to keep it hushed up with the preacher declaring he was retiring while giving no reason.

The news ultimately did get out though.

Randal Graves said...

Oh, Bicycle Man, you're just jealous because you don't have one of those swanky pope hats.

Demeur said...

Before you blow a horn touting the RCC you need to do a little homework into their history. I can't recall any of the world's religions calling for the torture and murder or non believers and suspected non believers ie the catholic inquisition. Any clown on this planet who thinks he's infallible is a fool as are those who believe that. Anyone who is placed in that position of unquestioned authority is nothing more than a cult leader. A pointy hat and some decree does not place you above the law. If they think they'll have any credibility as an organized religion then the pope should step down but I forgot he's perfect and that would just expose the whole charade. Stuck between a rock and a moral swamp of shit. No?

Nicole E. Hirschi aka CJT said...

Amen is all I can say to that MRM, Amen.

Anonymous said...

You sure got the anti-papist worms coming out of the woodwork on this one, Crummy.